Seeking Publisher - Here we go again

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:06 am

I'm now on my third and hopefully last agent. I write for the UK market (historical saga-type historicals) and I always wanted a UK agent, which I finally got.

When I first started out I didn't know that much about the industry and signed a contract with one really bad agent, who has since retired. I then signed with an American agent, who was new and knew less about the industry than I did. I also realised that an American agent won't help me sell to UK publishers.

What I've learnt over the last ten years is a lot. A few of the main things are;
Editors work with agents they know. So submit to agents who deal with the work you write, and to editors who publish what you write. So many times I've seen writers submit their romance work to agents who deal with fantasy or horror, etc. Do your research.

Never pay an agent upfront. Agents get paid when they have sold your work, not before. When your royalty cheque comes through the agent will deduct his % from it.

Don't waste time submitting one at a time. Even if they say they won't accept multiple submissions, do it. Otherwise you'll be old and grey before anything happens. (I'm an acquisitions editor for Enspiren Press, so I know it happens)

Slush piles are truly large, and fewer people are being picked from them. If you write romance, and aim for the USA romance market, try to enter some of the romance competitions whose judges are editors from publishers. I know of many authors who got their start via the contest route.

Lastly, never give up. Which ever route you take to have your book published is fine, just make sure you do your research first.

Oh, and don't forget to learn about promoting - for when you do become published, as you'll be doing a lot of it. Surprised

)
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Regards,
Anne Whitfield
http://www.annewhitfield.com
historical & contemporary author

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Sun Jan 20, 2008 11:18 am

It's not an easy task, getting your manuscript read.

First, you have to get past the initial reader. If the words don't jump off the pages and click with this reader, then your book is on the slush pile. Okay, so you've made it this far, what about the editor, did he/she like it?

You may get a request for the full manuscript, if this happens you're in for a chance. But it's still not that easy.

Your manuscript will be on the conference table with another eight or so books. Only one person in that room is fighting for your book, so they have to be passionate about it.

Sadly, only one or two manuscripts will be chosen. Doesn't give us much of a chance does it?

Most agents rejection letter state that they only take on one or two new authors on every year. Sad

Even with these odds, I'm still determined to find an agent for Lawless Justice, an urban thriller about a female vigilante bikers gang. It's new, and it's edgy.

I've been down the SP route, and it's hard work. Especially when you live in a tiny village on an island in Greece.

However, In Times of Violence has been very successful and has had some good press buzz.

The follow up to I.T.O.V, HUNTRESS, will also be SP. For the simple reason my readers demand another book and the traditional process takes too long.

Give me an agent and there will be no stopping me! cheers

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Heads and Tales out now!
http://www.lulu.com/karina-kantas

Admin Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 2062 Location : UK

I found this comment posted on an interesting blog:

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Sun Jan 20, 2008 3:47 pm

You're right, Shelagh, that was interesting. I am of the opinion that ebooks, and the little reader thingys that make reading them so convenient and portable are worth shooting at. It just makes sense to me, especially with so many clamoring to 'save the trees'. Having done the 'mass transit' thing for many years, I know you can only read so many papers and carry so many books with you. With the readers one could take numerous 'books' along for a ride, without being weighted down with cumbersome baggage. What a great idea, and perhaps one whose time has come?
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Zada Connaway
Mother's Journals: parts 1, 2 and 3 ISBN # 1-4241-6969-0

http://www.zadaconnaway.com/

Subject: Malcolm, Sun Jan 20, 2008 6:23 pm

In your first post here on this thread you said, "However, I'm concerned about their ability to really promote the book. "

I know authors who are connected with big, major, traditional publishers such as McGraw-Hill who do most of their own promotion. Taking that into consideration, I would think the world is your oyster and you could go with whomever you felt comfortable with and who fit the requirements you have as you will probably being doing the bulk of your promoting yourself.

I started my publishing company for myself, however I am able to publish other books as well. I don't know if I want to get into that or not. I have been approached. Until I get my book marketed the way I want it to be I am not taking on any more projects. I have been reading and reviewing books for others and for those who are not published yet, I have been guiding them in various ways without promoting my own publishing company. Like I said, I am not ready for that yet.

I think it comes down to how much you want to put of YOU in your book, what controls you want to have, if you have to do it all yourself, and your financial situation.

I have not read the rest of this thread. Guess I should do that. I look forward to what you decide.
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http://www.weavingdreamspublishing.com
http://suesunshine.blogspot.com/
http://suesunshine.wordpress.com/

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:41 pm

Hi Linzi,

I knew going in that a POD publisher wasn't going to do anything to promote my book. So, I'm not going that route again.

While the book might not have been promoted much if it had been published by, say, HarperCollins, it would have had a competitive price, would have been reviewed by newspaper and other reviewers, and would have been more likely to be placed in a bookstore. POD books fail on all of those counts.

Malcolm
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Malcolm R. Campbell

http://www.malcolmrcampbell.com

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:47 pm

Georgie,

Your first trip out with your first publisher was definitely not optimal. I might have gone straight to POD after that kind of "luck."

How are you getting around the challenges of selling POD fiction in a world where it's not respected?

* Most bookstores won't stock it
* Most reviewers won't review it
* Most customers don't like the higher retail price

So far, in the vastness of the internet, I've found it exceptionally difficult to attract prospective readers to blogs and websites, much less gamble $19.95 on the book.

How do you get around such things?

Malcolm
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Malcolm R. Campbell

http://www.malcolmrcampbell.com

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:52 pm

Anne,

I don't mind promoting my book. With a small traditional press, I would at least be doing it on a level playing field because I wouldn't have all of the disadvantages and bad press about POD to contend with.

Large houses might, one day, smell the roses (coffee or whatever). Most of their books fail. Instead of fixing that problem, they try to make everything with celebrity stuff and BIG BOOKS.

Large or small, I would expect the press who publishes my next novel to send out at least a hundred (it should be three times that) review copies, news releases, and to at least take a stab at setting up a few interviews. If they don't do this with their resources, they can't expect an author to do it with zero financial resources and zero contacts.

I think you're right, though, in that small might be better.

Malcolm
_________________
Malcolm R. Campbell

http://www.malcolmrcampbell.com

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:57 pm

Hi Karina,

Best of luck finding an agent. I'd rather have somebody in my court from the beginning rather than having my book sit on that table with little support.

What I'm always curious about is the high number of books that get published every year that, while I like them a lot, seem to be the very kind that nobody would publish.

That is, they are "literary" fiction and read nothing like, say, a John Grisham book or a Stephen King book. Many of these novels are several hundred thousand words long when, according to most gurus, it's very difficult to get anyone interested in anything much over 100,000.

It's a puzzlement. Neutral

Malcolm
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Malcolm R. Campbell

http://www.malcolmrcampbell.com

Four Star Member Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 376

Hi Malcolm, I was in Sales and Sales Management for a while. Reached Area Sales Manager, had my butt in a shiny black lowered Mercedes with sports box, spoilers and alloys and enjoyed wearing expensive suits.

The more I learned about people and products and why folks buy things and customer loyalty and all that stuff, the more convinced I became that all marketing is basically a bunch of bollocks. I found that the best business came from referrals, period. I even built up a Sales office that survived entirely on referral business. We were the envy of every other company in the city and our monthly advertising budget was less than £100.

It is my experience that if you sell good quality kit that you would buy yourself, provide a service and after sales support you would expect yourself and genuinely care about your customers, word of mouth will eventually produce enough referred leads that marketing becomes no longer necessary. Word gets around quickly. Companies that make second rate produce, offer mediocre service and poor after sales support need to spend millions every year to attract enough new business to remain in business. Word of mouth doesn't work for them. Funnily enough these companies don't believe in word of mouth and that's why me and the British Sales industry no longer see eye to eye on very much.

Bearing this in mind, I figured that if my book was good enough, it would sell by word of mouth once folks started reading it. I'm doing my own marketing to get it kickstarted. The book has only been available for 3 weeks so it's early days yet but I really do believe that word of mouth is that powerful it can take a PoD book, if it's good enough, and make it a bestseller.

Of course, if my book isn't good enough, then I don't deserve to have a bestseller, whether I find a publisher or not. Did all that make sense? Pwobably not.

lol!

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:48 pm

Shelagh,

Thanks for the link. That was well worth reading as was the New York Times article he mentioned.

Malcolm
_________________
Malcolm R. Campbell

http://www.malcolmrcampbell.com

Subject: Re: Seeking Publisher - Here we go again Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:51 pm

George,

You're right about word of mouth. When it comes down to it, much of what we do comes about because a friend or a co-worker heard about it and called it to our attention.

If an author loves people and loves getting out and making the rounds, then s/he is going to create a continuing word of mouth, especially when--as you note--the book is a good one in the first place.

Malcolm
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Malcolm R. Campbell

http://www.malcolmrcampbell.com

Age : 32 Joined : 20 Jan 2008 Posts : 9

You know, I was thinking. If a new author stumbles accross this thread, it may turn them away from trying to get published. It wouldn't be fair to assume people should go one route and not the other. I have tried the big houses and yes was turned down. It didn't make my works any less than what they were, good stories. I just didn't have the experience. I kept trying, doing more research and checking who's publishing what better than I was before. Two of my books were accepted by POD publishers and didn't charge me to publisher my work. My books will always be available and will be printed when ordered so they aren't sitting in some warehouse somewhere. A lot of publishers are using this print method now.

I say keep trying and eventually it will happen!

Amber

Admin Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 2062 Location : UK

Hi Amber,

Don't worry about putting off new would-be authors. This is, after all, the Published Authors Forum. LOL! Wink

The points raised on this thread, however, will show aspiring writers and authors how difficult it is to actually sell books. Being published is only the beginning -- the hard work really begins once the book is in print.

Malcolm made some very good comments about established authors such as Grisham and King. The way they write now is not the way they wrote their first novel. John Grisham went the PoD route before he signed with a commercial publisher and his first book was probably more literary fiction than pure fiction.

My advice to anyone who has written a novel would be: write another. If the second book is no better than the first, you won't make it. Tough but true.

~Shelagh
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Shelagh Watkins
http://shelaghwatkins.co.uk/

Four Star Member Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 376

Hi Amber, yes, you have a point there. I'm definitely not against going to publishers first, that's how you learn and you may even find an editor who will take you on. I would encourage all aspiring writers to approach editors at publishing houses.

What I was trying to get across (and I agree, my posts can come across as anti-publishers) is that if you're turned down by everyone, that's not the end of the road. There are still options open to you.

When my second novel is ready, I may send it out to a few publishers with a cover note telling them I'm a published author to see if I get any bites. I know a good few editors by name now and I'm sure some of them will probably remember me. Who knows what may come of it? But even if my book is rejected, that won't be the end of the road for me because I'll still see that book in print and on shelves in folks homes.